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  2. Good luck with your mission. The first thing that needs changing is that dogs must have a change of status from a mere "belonging" to that of a family member. Perhaps to keep the dog haters happy we should call them "minor family members" or something similar. Of course we should not limit it just to dogs. Cats and other animals can mean just as much to people.qui A further area for you to consider is the problem of finding accommodation for the person who wins custody of the family pet. So many people have to relinquish their much loved pet due to landlords imposing restrictions on pets in properties. I am sure that children do just as much damage in a property as many pets.
  3. The OP had already been guided in the direction of COAPE and APBC. There was no need to provide a further list of people, many of them duplicates, but most of them trainers rather than behaviourists. By your own admission a behaviourist was needed so why add a whole lot of trainers into the mix? The OP was more than capable of doing their own internet research and just needed some guidance towards a quality source of behaviour advice. That quality is more than adequately supplied, in this country, by either APBC or COAPE. Job done.
  4. Today
  5. GM2, as U believed that the membership of ABTC was merely a fellowship organization & were previously unaware of its existence [as was i], would U concede that i introduced new knowledge to the forum? - Particularly that the ABTC has the avowed intent of regulation of the pet-training industry, which is surely overdue, & welcome news. - terry
  6. I will note that for some time, the APDT-uk accepted overseas members; if they still did, i'd be on their roster. APDT-Ireland is also domestic only.
  7. the APDT-uk is excellent, as is the APDT-Ireland & the APDT-Aus. Ireland & the UK both assess all applicants before approval; Oz requires any applicant to have a sponsor who is already a member, knows the applicant, & who is willing to attest that the applicant does not use aversive tools, & does use humane training: pos-R primarily / neg-P rarely; no intimidation, flooding, confrontation, etc. The USA-apdt was founded by Ian Dunbar, DVM - just like the APDT-uk. Once it was well-established, he left, & it rolled on without him, electing Board members, voting on policy, etc. So the organization was rooted in the same fertile concept, but the USA BoD decided later - for the Admins' own reasons, not any desire of the membership body! - to go for mass appeal & sheer organizational size, vs grow a crop of humane trainers by educating trainers & retaining its original 'dog-friendly' mandate. As a long-time member, i was stunned when i first realized that i'd need to personally vet any fellow member i referred to, per a long-distance inquiry; i had to check their websites, look at UTube clips, read articles they'd written, etc, before i could safely refer a dog-owner to my "fellow trainer". The sole exceptions were trainers whose methods i already knew, but let's face it, the USA is a helluva big backyard, & when i joined, we were fewer than 2,000 members across 50 states. It took a while for the original mandate to expire, & for growing numbers of traditional AKA punitive trainers to dilute our ranks, but it went on year after year. // Now, approx 40% of the USA-apdt consists of trainers who still use pre-WW-2 tools & methods, from choke, prong, & shock collars to double-handed leash jerks to "correct" a dog. Some claim to be "force-free" because they never STRIKE the dog, nor even touch them; they use 'a nick' - known to the rest of us as an electric shock, delivered by a remote control. Others are fans of the Dawg Wrassler or are merely riding his coattails, using his lingo ['red zone', balanced, dominant, etc] to mesmerize clients, & pinning dogs or stringing them up as needed, whilst boasting of their USA-apdt legitimacy. Some are cross-registered with the IACP, "International Association of Canine Professionals" - IACP members are banned from criticizing any "recognized tools & methods" of dog-training, & may not criticize another member - as in, ever. If a member is arrested & convicted of animal cruelty, s/he is stricken from the rolls; but until then, no one in the IACP may say anything critical of their tools or tactics. The IACP is also famous for their in-house issued "certification" which evaporates if U stop paying dues - it isn't 3rd party assessed, & is not portable. U go? - it's gone. U know things have come to a pretty pass when the Organization Previously Known As Dog-Friendly is touted by a franchise seller of shock-collars - newly-minted franchisees of Sit-Means-S*it are urged to join the USA-apdt, not to learn other non-aversive methods!, Heaven forbid, but to expand their consumer appeal & add a professional gloss to their website, a logo to the facility door or their business cards, & most of all, to give the impression that they use reward-based training. Since SMS franchisees are apparently incapable of teaching a puppy to sit without the franchise-approved shock collar, getting customers in the door is key to making the pitch & getting the sale; the USA-apdt logo helps them do it. The USA-apdt was the 1st trainers' organization in the U-S; it could have been a force for great good. Instead, they divided their membership & lost momentum, allowed the IACP to outgrow them, & were finally co-opted by traditional training in the name of "mass appeal". It was a sad trajectory. The Pet Professional Guild has taken over what could have been USA-apdt's place, as a trustworthy source of humane trainers who specifically do not, may not use aversive tools or coercive methods. // The PPG has had growing pains, they claim to be "international" but publish all materials in English, which makes the member benefits of brochures, etc, useless to most non-USA prospective members. Hopefully they'll outgrow this insular attitude - soon. - terry
  8. LUCKY Details application and photos
  9. LADY Details application and photos
  10. LILA AND DAZZLER Details photos and application form
  11. SHEENA Details photos and application form
  12. There is some support and advice available for owners with legal wrangles although the laws as they stand need to be brought up to date to take into account modern day attitudes to pets. Trevor Cooper is regarded as the most experienced dog law solicitor .He has a website -
  13. Hello. I would love to hear from people who have been involved in a pet custody dispute following separation/divorce. I am a University lecturer (in England) specialising in animal law and I am undertaking research on pet custody disputes. There is very little research on this area of law and yet it appears that thousands of couples in the UK each year are involved in a dispute over who is going to get the family dog when they separate. If you have been involved in a pet custody dispute over a dog and would be willing to talk to me about your experience please contact me at I would like to give a voice to pet owners to ensure greater understanding amongst legal professionals and academics on this issue.
  14. We have the British APDT @arealhuman. Their motto is Kind, Fair and Effective. All members are required to have some experience, to have been studying and, most importantly, they have to be assessed. This means that another, experienced, APDT member sits in on one their classes and writes a report to the APDT. If the trainer passes on all these points it does not end there. They are required, for continuing membership, to undertake regular CPD (Continuous Professional Development). The APDT run lots of courses that trainers can attend and have an extensive library of appropriate books for members to borrow. So you see that any old Tom, Dick or Harry cannot just put their names on a register, as with some organisations, they really do have to have a good understanding of dog training in a Kind, Fair and Effective way. Most importantly, they also have to be prepared to keep learning. If you scroll through the posts on here you will see many recommendations for the APDT whether it is for Puppy Classes, Adult Classes or One-to-One sessions.
  15. As a first time dog owner and previously looking at training in a lot of detail, this desperately needs regulating in the UK IMHO; there are so many bodies and individuals offering training, all listing differing and sometimes unverifiable bodies that they've supposedly been approved by or qualifications they hold, its' ridiculous. I would also like to see a minimum training qualification for the dog trainers too, after all they are training people and dogs and they should be able to understand how people learn and coach them accordingly. It would not be a stretch for me or anyone else to set up their own dog training council/institution/body, with the requisite snazzy website full of largely meaningless information, and go into business on the basis of that! I am certain there are reputable and honest dog trainers out there, but from my research there are also those that are in it purely for the money.
  16. Much easier, surely then, to just go straight to the APBC website and choose a Fully Qualified Behaviourist form there. Why sift through all the names of trainers on another list? Will you just concede please, Leashed for Life, that those of us working in the sector over here know more about it than those from other countries? I would not presume, for example, to question your knowledge of how to find a good behaviourist in the States.
  17. Does he cock his leg when he pees? This is a sign of sexual maturity and helps with knowing what might be going on. What ages was he neutered? I concur with all that JoanneF has said about a re visit to reward based house training. You will know that he has "got it" when he seeks you out to accompany him to the garden so that he can get a reward for his outdoor pee! Was he a summer puppy? Some dogs that are house trained in the summer confuse the inside and outside of a house and are not really fully house trained. So, again, back to basics. Is he worried about anything in the outdoor environment? Any loud noises, new neighbours etc? Fear can produce and need to seek "relief". That can lead a dog to pee in order to feel "relief" even if only for a short time. Anxiety of any sort can produce this behaviour. What is his relationship with your other dog like? Would he be worried, for instance, to stop and pee in the garden for fear of being pounced on? It might be fun to the other dog but not so much for him?
  18. follow-up Qs - I just re-read the OP, & wondered if U were ever in the room when he pee'd on the floor? --- Did he react to something outside, can he see outside from that room or from the specific area where urine was found? Does he leg-lift when outdoors to pee, or does he squat pre-puberty puppy style? Thanks in advance, - terry
  19. Yesterday
  20. welcome, & I'm sorry to hear of Ur trouble. How long was he error-free in his housetraining? // IOW, how long was it between the time he, presumably under 6-MO, was 'in the process' of being housetrained, & then after he was clean & dry indoors, the 1st instance of urine or stool when he did NOT have a UTI, diarrhea, or urgency to void b/c he'd been left indoors for too long? Most dogs with normal bladders & bowel-function who are 6-MO or older, & not yet seniors, can wait 6-hours to 8-hours between potty-trips - assuming that they're taken out to void immediately B4 that countdown began, of course, & that no unusual changes have occurred - a switch in diet, virus / bacteria, ate trash / drank contaminated water while out, etc. I definitely agree with JoAnne that a vet-exam is imperative; changes in behavior always warrant a vet visit, & changes in bladder continence can have many physical / medical causes. // If he were mine, i'd ask for a urine culture to ascertain if he has a subclinical UTI - one that lacks many of the symptoms of a urinary infection, but the dog is in fact infected. There's a nasty multi-resistant UTI that's gone global, which occurs in both humans & dogs - it can be subclinical & chronic, hard to Dx & even harder to get rid of; hopefully he does *not* have that, it's hard to kill & tends to recur. U have 2 dogs, both male - how certain are U that this is the dog who's piddling indoors? ... A CC-TV positioned to cover the areas where he's been prone to pee might be surprising. [I say this as i've had past clients who were certain they knew which of their dogs was "guilty", & were shocked to find they'd fingered the wrong dog, when a video camera recorded the same action, but by a different dog.] How old was he when U believed he'd been reliably housetrained? // Was he marking before he was desexed? Most dogs who are neutered after they begin leg-lifting [which starts around puberty; on average, at abt 6-mos age] continue to leg-lift, as they've already learned that behavior. Once learned, it's not un-learned. Also, marking is minimal pee for display or communication purposes; does he pee multiple times in a 12 to 18-hour period indoors, 2-hours or less apart? If so, that sounds more like an irritated urethra, incompetent sphincter, UTI, or other urinary issues. Marking isn't voiding; M dogs basically withhold some urine as a marking reservoir, & need to be taught to empty ALL their bladder, not "most of it". // If he's voiding indoors, a puddle not a spot, & doing it often, i'd suspect diabetes - especially if he also drinks excessively. // Ask Ur vet whether a blood-sugar test might be apropos - be ready to offer some idea of how often he drinks, & how much water at a time, plus how often he urinates, & how much on average - also, does he mark / void overnight? Or can he wait at least 6 hours or even longer, from the time U go to bed until U get up & let him out? after the vet gives the all-clear [no UTI, bladder adhesion, kidney or bladder stones, etc], i'd try to start pairing his indoor marking with any precipitating events. For some dogs, the sight of another M dog leg-lifting outside their home, is a trigger to mimic that behavior - but they're indoors, unfortunately, & that's a problem. Other dogs, even after desex, will react to the scent of estrus - but usually that comes with other visible behaviors: chattering teeth, appetite's down, whines / yelps / howls / barks for no very obvious cause, restless, escape attempts, etc. Is there anything U can think of, that seems to be associated / coincidental with his marking or urinating indoors? - Terry Terry Pride, certified Vet's Assistant; member Truly Dog-Friendly
  21. question, @gypsysmum2 - Did U actually read the requirements to register as a Clinical Animal Behaviorist [CAB] with the ABTC? Or did U look at a different list of practitioners, recognize a few names, & assume that those persons were CABs? ABTC recognizes more than 1 level of expertise; they list 7 - 1: ABTC Standard - Animal Trainer 2: ABTC Standard - Animal Training Instructor 3: ABTC Standard - Animal Behaviour Technician 4: ABTC Standard - Clinical Animal Behaviourist 5: ABTC Standard - Veterinary Behaviourist 6: ABTC Standard - Accredited Animal Behaviourist 7: ABTC Standard for individuals who engage in work as a legal expert witness 'Animal trainer' is the lowest entry point, which is UK national standard educational Level 3; instructors are qualified to teach trainers, & are education Level 4; technician is Level 5; Clinical Animal Behaviorist, the group to which i referred, is education Level 6. Vet-Behaviorists under ABTC purview, need "only" meet the same requirements as the CABs do, which is less-stringent than the extra 4-years of study demanded by the College of Veterinary Behavior in the U.S.A., but is still a high bar. // See the pertinent listing at the link, above. If U look at the practitioners listed under CAB, every one of them is an APBC member - so why are they cross-listed with the ABTC? Because IMO ABTC is a higher standard, & adds to one's professionalism. To be listed, U must 1st be a pro member of an organization that agrees to abide by all ABTC standards of practice - which includes the APBC, IAABC, Brit Vet-nurses Assoc, Brit Small-Animal Vets Assoc, 'INTO Dogs', & so on. Then, as a member of that recognized organization, U can further apply to be listed by the ABTC as a practitioner. Only the 'Accredited Animal Behaviorist' does not specify the minimum educational level required; the Expert Witness standard requires that an applicant has met the stipulated education level to become an ABTC practitioner, BEFORE they apply to be an expert witness. from the ABTC April 2017 newsletter, i quote, "ABTC registers audit As part of ABTC's ethos of quality & transparency, the published registers of practitioners was [EDIT: were] audited in March 2017. A random list of names was selected from each register, & their credentials - including CPD records - were independently verified as meeting the required standard to qualify for an entry on the appropriate register." 'Accredited Animal Behaviorist' is the register that lists Ms Bondarenko, via her membership of the IAABC - for their standards, see Chirag Patel is another excellent UK trainer whom i know via the 'net; he too, is an IAABC member, an ABTC listed AAB, & is, per the ABTC, a certified Parrot consultant - which is intriguing, as i know him as a dog trainer, & my parrots were the species that completed my crossover to pos-R training in my 20s, yet i didn't know we had psittacines in common. Like the APBC, the BSAVA, etc, the APDT-uk were among the founding organizations of this umbrella group. // IAABC entered the roster later; PPG / the force-free Pet Professional Guild, is not yet a member, but I think that's probably inevitable as PPG formalizes their own standards for higher qualifications above 'trainer'. Accreditation continues to become more & more formalized, & basic to professional status - in all disciplines, including dog training & B-Mod. This is IME & IMO, a good thing. - terry
  22. Hello, welcome to the forum. First step might be a vet check to make sure nothing medical is causing it. Castrated males will still scent mark so make sure your cleaner is biological (I'm not familiar with it). You said he does it even being out in the garden; does he have free access? That can actually be counterproductive to house training because it blurs the boundaries between indoors and out. If any of that sounds possible, then back to basics with house trianing. It's not uncommon for a dog to regress. So set him up to succeed by taking him out even more than he needs. When he toilets outdoors make a huge fuss (never mind the neighbours, act like outdoor toileting is the best thing you have ever seen) and reward him with a high value treat. Do that immediately, don't make him come to you for the treat so he is clear that it's for toileting and not for coming to you. The idea is that he eventually wants to earn the treat enough to hold the toilet until he is outside. If he has an accident inside don't react at all. If you get annoyed he may learn to fear your reaction and avoid you if he needs to toilet - the opposite of what you want. Indoors if you see him circling or scratching the floor, that can sometimes precede toileting so get him out fast.
  23. Hi, We have 2 lovely bassett hounds, both boys (castrated at under 2 yrs) who are now approaching 3 & 4. The younger one (who has always been more of a handful than the older one) had got House training sorted and we were accident free. Lately though he has started weeing on the lounge floor (wood floor thank god!). At first we thought it might be after left inside too long and he got caught short, but he does it straight after being in the garden for even an hour or so. We clean up and deodorise afterwards with Simple Solution to stop the smell of urine inviting him back to reoffend. Very frustrating but I'm looking for tips on how to stop this before it comes a real problem. Any advice would be welcome, thanks.
  24. GM2, they wouldn't get paid for long, if they were violating professional ethics. // They'd be out of the veterinary profession, off the rolls of licensed practitioners, & finding another career - after spending the better part of their youth, on average to 30-YO, either in college [4-years undergrad, 4-years post-grad] or in an apprenticeship to merely become a DVM with an independent license, ready to open a solo practice or a full partnership. Just to rub salt in that suicidal wound, anyone further Board-certified has wasted another 2-years or more of money & time, with yet-more schooling & more debt. So the veterinary behaviorist would kiss good-bye at least 14 years of education, spent reaching that status, only to lose it forever by doing something against the profession's well-known, published ethics... just to make a few bucks, on a few out-of-area cases? Who would be so incredibly stoopid as to shoot themselves in the foot, lose their livelihood & their license, permanently, over something so puny? I find it astonishing that U'd actually believe this. // FWIW, one of the vet-behaviorists who does remote consults is Nicholas Dodman, DVM - who is head of the Behavioral Dept of the Cummings College of Vet-Medicine, within Tufts University. Herewith a snippet from an interview he did with The Bark magazine, explaining 'what's a behaviorist?' as defined in the U.S.A. QUOTE, "Bark: 'What is an animal behaviorist? What qualifies someone to be called a behaviorist?' Dodman: "There are only two qualified types of behaviorists; one who is endorsed and certified by the Animal Behavior Society (ABS), the so-called certified Applied Animal Behaviorist (CAAB). And the veterinary ones, who are the diplomates of the American College of Veterinary Behavior. For the ABS, the minimum starting point is a master’s degree, but a lot of certified (applied) animal behaviorists have a PhD. That’s the non-veterinary variety. In order to become a veterinary behaviorist, you have to do a vet degree first, taking four years after college, then one year internship, & then the residency program that is normally three years long. In other words, it’s another four years after the DVM that you become eligible to sit for the specialty examination in behavior. So after leaving high school, the ABS is a minimum of twelve years of study. And then you have to sit a pretty hard exam. These are the two types of people who are qualified animal behaviorists." ________________________________________________________ I think that makes it very clear, just how much breaking the veterinary Code of Ethics would cost. The bold within Dr Dodman's reply is added for clarification. The quote's origin is here - Karen Overall, DVM, DCVB, is another vet-behaviorist who does remote consults. // She's also founder of the Journal of Veterinary Behavior: clinical applications & research, & the prime editor thereof. It's called the JVB for short. // She enjoys a global reputation for excellence in her field. There are several video-clips on UTube with Dr Overall, interviews & presentations, that are worth the time to watch. The most-recent issue of JVB is here - The JVB is now in Volume 20 - 2 decades of publication; the July-Aug 2017 issue's main focus is stereotypies - causes, prevention, rehab. There are articles on horses, big cats, parrots, & captive wildlife in general, all vis-a-vis stereotypies. Then there are individual articles on research including dogs [2], cats [1], hogs [2], cattle [1], poultry [1], & Policy [1]. I do not think Dr Overall would casually discard her hard-won & very dearly-cherished vocation for the equivalent of Esau's mess of pottage. - Terry
  25. a fellow trainer in the U.K., Nina Bonderenko, just told me about the Animal Behavior & Training Council [ABTC]. While exploring the website, i read their practitioner standards page - applaudably specific, & very clear on academic requirements - & then came across their newsletter, which included an announcement that they are working toward regulating the dog-training field. My opinion: The current lack of any regulations means that the most appalling claptrap can be sold at a profit as 'training', & that outrageous claims for speed or guarantees of results are made; any shortfall in the outcome is blamed on the owner. Old-fashioned tools designed solely to cause discomfort or outright pain are justified by their long history, such as choke-chains AKA infinite-slip collars, or prong collars - both pre-date the World Wars, & in those 77 to 100-plus years, we've learned a lot of new things about dogs - how they learn, their capabilities, dog cognition, dog emotions. So why are we using the same aversive tools, with the same punitive mindset, as our great-great-grandfathers?! I'm delighted that ABTC plans to set standards & push dog-training out of the 19th century & into the 22nd. It's well-past time that actual credentials & assessed knowledge were required, before someone can advertise their services & charge dog-owners for their supposed expertise. Soon, anyone advertising will have to back-up their claims of knowledge with where & when they acquired it, & grandiose claims for "cures" in a few hours' time will be banned, consigned to history with the patent-medicine hucksters of the 1880s thru the 1930s, that these trainers & their self-promoting spiel so much resemble. Back to the ABTC - after reading the newsletter [ see link below ], i followed up a note that they'd published a position paper on ethical dog training. So i read that - it's wonderful. I can't help but wish, foolishly, that the USA-apdt had kept their original dog-friendly mission, & had gone on to publish a similar document, standing by their original mandate to spread science-based, reward-based, training & behavior modification without flooding, confrontation, brute force, intimidation, applied pain, ad nauseum. Sadly, the USA-apdt now has approx 40% membership who use 'traditional methods' - choke, prong, & / or shock collars, rattle cans, throw chains, pin-the-dog a'la the Dawg Wrassler, water balloons, air-horns, & all the other things that can hurt, frighten, or startle a dog into "being good", when if we're truthful, in 99% of cases, the dog was NEVER BAD - simply being a dog. // The USA-apdt's mission has utterly changed, from 'educate owners & trainers in dog-friendly methods', to 'become the representative organization for professional dog-trainers in the U.S.A.'. It's too big a tent, & has divided the membership irrevocably, IMO. "Ethical Dog-training' by the ABTC can be found here - I will be asking if they accept applicants from outside the U.K. their most-recent newsletter is here - with the announced intent of national regulation of dog-training: ]
  26. I think you will find that this is a "register" of like minded people. I know several of the members listed and they are dog trainers. Yes, the ones I know, are very good dog trainers but they are not qualified Pet Behaviour Therapists. If they were they would almost certainly have become members of the APBC or COAPE.
  27. @SamR - a very thorough vet-exam before consulting any behaviorist would also be a Good Idea - checking all his joints for pain, checking for normal senses [eyes, ears, no tactile abnormalities, etc], possibly a full blood-panel - not just a cellular count, but liver & kidney enzymes, etc. Keeping a log for a day or two of the dog's behavior prior to the vet-appt might be helpful - how much he eats / when / what he eats, how often & how much he voids, any usual-for-him quirks & the CONTEXT they appear in [such as his "hide my head" behavior, when does he do that?], & so on. A written outline of Ur concerns & when they began, such as the "hide my head" first seen on the car-trip from the breeder, would be very helpful to the vet - how old was he when he first actively resisted leaving the house? 3-MO? 6-MO? // Can U think of anything unusual that predated the 1st time he fought the leash? I really hope U can find a knowledgeable pro who can help - this must be very frustrating for U, & very limiting for the dog. - terry
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